AI Announcer (00:05.558)
Welcome to Prompt This, the podcast tailored for those savvy business leaders who are utterly fed up with the endless AI hype and are hungry for the genuine article. Meet Greg, your seasoned expert, the go-to guy for scaling sales teams and unraveling the secrets of the Silicon Valley playbook. And then there's Clint, a startup veteran who has a knack for transforming colossal ideas into flourishing ventures. Together, they slice through the chaos.
to deliver insightful analysis and practical playbooks on leveraging AI to ignite new ideas, expand your business, and ensure you're never left in the dust. So without further ado, let's introduce your dynamic hosts.
Greg (00:52.878)
All right, it's Greg here. This is an exciting episode. If I think about the thing I liked the most about it is just his all encompassing view of orchestrating what a sales organization needs and how to bring AI in it. He's really articulate in that. I liked that part.
And this is Clint. Yeah, I gotta tell you, today's guest, you kept telling me he's a sales leader, but he's got the head of an engineer. He's a very thorough thinker and did a great job walking us through how he sees AI not just being rolled out inside of sales organization, but all of the mechanics of what a great agentic AI system looks like.
Let's get into the episode.
Let's do it.
Clint (01:46.734)
Today's guest is Ben Taft. He's a veteran global sales and revenue operations executive currently serving as VP of global sales operations at ARM. He oversees worldwide field operations, sales systems, and revenue process optimization, driving operational excellence across global commercial teams. Before joining ARM, Ben led sales operations and go-to-market strategy at NetApp, Tintree, and Fusion.io.
as well as leadership roles at 8x8 and Brocade. He also serves on the Product Advisory Board at TigerEye, guiding enterprise sales software innovation. Welcome, Ben.
Thanks guys, appreciate you taking some time to have me and looking forward to our discussion today.
All right. Yeah, this is going be a great discussion. Just for the audience, I've worked with Ben in the past and I've got a great story. I was working at 8x8 and we were ready to kind of move up the enterprise stack. So we brought in some high-end VPs and Ben walked in the door and became my new boss. And basically on about day three, we had offices right next to each other and we both simultaneously walked out of our offices.
wearing the exact same outfit. And he looked over at me. He took a right and went over the executive wing. I took a left, went to the sales floor, and we never saw each other again that day.
Ben Taft (03:17.318)
You clearly got my on day one, right?
Really got the whole story.
There go. I think you're taking the dress like your boss thing a little too far there.
That's great. no, Ben was a great guy to work for real strategic and I learned a ton working for him. So I'm really happy to have you here for this discussion is gonna be fun today.
Well, thanks, Greg. I appreciate it. And I noticed we're not wearing the same thing today. not today.
Clint (03:46.518)
evolved. Step in the right direction. hey, Ben, you you've got a you've got a title of VP of global sales operations that for those folks who work in tech, they probably know what that means right away. But maybe not everybody does. How do you explain what you do to somebody outside of tech?
I think one of the ways that I look at this role is a bit like kind of running the railroad. You've got a multitude of travelers, trains, agendas, logistics, everything coming together at once in maybe a singular location. And you are trying to optimize everything that goes in and out. That's kind of one way to look at it. I think the other way to look at it is
Many times you play the role as an invisible hand inside the organization that has visibility across a wide spectrum of functions, whether you've got enough knowledge in terms of how marketing works and how those campaigns are going to be cascading across your different go-to-market channels. You understand how finance looks at various deals and revenue and where their efforts to maximize revenue and margin comes into play.
You understand the initiatives being driven down from the executives. And then you maybe understand all the demands that the field teams are trying to balance in terms of their priorities. And then you've got lines of business that have different priorities and objectives. So you're in a unique position to sort of see all of these different efforts and competing priorities. And many times you are the invisible hand that's behind sort of helping nudge or navigate or align those resources.
kind of resolving conflicts, I don't want to say discreetly, but resolving them in a way that everybody feels like the oars are moving in the same direction. And sometimes you're maybe perhaps a bit more visible in those efforts, sometimes you're very much invisible in those efforts, but people just know that maybe there was a problem and suddenly the problem has now resolved itself and everything is moving in a seamless fashion.
Clint (05:59.054)
Have you always been doing this? Is this your career for decades or is this something new that you've come to?
No, I think if you look back, there's times I've run marketing organizations way back when in the salary networks. And I've helped build sales organizations. I've run sales organizations. And then I've run all the various revenue and sales operation functions. So many times it's just bringing together all of those various elements.
So having run all of these various departments, you can really put yourself in everybody's shoes and understand what their strengths are, if they're good at what they do and where you need to help Band-Aid and who's on the right path, it sounds like.
Yeah, you're just, it's very unique role in most organizations.
Okay, so that brings us to AI. You're probably one of the first guests at global responsibility. So my question is, are you finding the same attitudes towards adoption in different regions around the globe?
Ben Taft (07:08.398)
The, how do I say this? The appetite for adoption is significant, more so than perhaps your more traditional platforms that you would go deploy. And as I talk to other colleagues and peers in this industry and other places at different events, you don't hear a complaint about
I can't get people to turn this on or I can't get people to utilize this or they're not really interested in this. I think if anything, when I talk to other peers in the industry, it comes more about there's so much out there that maybe perhaps people aren't sure which thing to adopt and how to use it. And that's because it just proliferates so fast and so wide. And you get
people spinning up all sorts of different forms of it, which is great. I'm so bullish on it and I want people out there, and when I talk to peers, we're all out there exploring and experimenting. The more that we experiment on this, the more we learn and the better it gets. You just see how transformational this can be. I think about adoption, it's about kind of keeping it controlled and managed and making sure it
It doesn't come across as just unscripted and unstructured because I think if it tends to do that in my experience across different change management, people just – they go into it. They really aren't quite told how to perhaps use it properly and then it just kind of becomes another little toy on the edge and you don't actually get meaningful adoption as opposed to initial adoption.
So what areas are you focusing on right now and rolling out AI? What's the area that gets you most excited?
Ben Taft (09:13.806)
I think the example that I might give is – you think of a typical seller who may have a – they may go on a call and this could apply to a number of different industries or companies. They go off a meeting or perhaps they've got an inbound something about a potential prospect and traditionally they may look at that, then they may go think about it and they may – okay, now got to go to – let me go to my
enablement platform and figure out where I can pull together all the resources that may apply and resonate with this particular customer based on their industry or their needs. And so then I'm going to go talk to my technical person and pull together some other stuff to help support it. And I'm going to kind of gather all this stuff up to figure out how do I go back to them and talk about a solution. And you've got all these different roles that may involve helping them prepare for that.
But many times they're pivoting around different systems and tools to go source and find that information. And I envision that obviously is that they would go into maybe their enablement agent, right? And say, listen, I've just engaged with this. I've got a follow-up. Help me prepare all of this. Help me prepare the market intelligence so I can speak a little bit more about the market they're in.
Help me find the various roadmap and case studies that would apply to this. Help me understand the technical solution merits that I may want to kind of zero in on when we get to that level. And then meanwhile, that enablement agent is thinking, great, I'm going to do all these sort of things. I know, by the way, would you also like me to go create an app to work with the sales ops agent to create an opportunity and the CRM and get that built out? And is there a, you know,
Is there a market intelligence out and where you want to go build some profiles of the individuals at that organization and understand, you know, their backgrounds. So you build a more personal relationship. now those agents are sort of working in concert behind each other and delivering up different results and content and resources that that seller can then go, that looks great. More of that. Nope, that's not quite on the mark. Let's do this.
Ben Taft (11:35.624)
And we've shifted their time focus to now really preparing how they can be more effective in front of that customer as to how do I go operate all these tools to get this information I need. Now they're orchestrating all of this information.
That is a, that's huge. I, I'm, you're describing this, I'm just thinking about the times I've worked at some pretty large enterprise companies and they've all acquired other companies and solutions or, you know, the, as a sales rep, just trying to even put a quote together sometimes, you know, you'd
You know, right now you can slack the team and see who's got the knowledge and they say, no, well that product came out before the integration. So you're not going to find the information in this knowledge base. You're going to find it over there. And, you know, you'd never know these things. And, you know, for instance, on day one, when I walked into one company, I was handed the price book and that was 417 pages. But then it came with a, a guide that was 1000.
and 14 pages of how to use the price book. now being able to orchestrate an agent to go just help me do that would just be huge. And that's only one use case I'm thinking of while you're talking about this.
I think that's where I envision a lot that the right balance is by zeroing in on a specific ask or task that maybe an operator of a tool would need to go do, really getting good at that with an agent that can really do that effectively. And that becomes another service that that visual agent surfaces up.
Ben Taft (13:29.518)
I probably should outlay, know, I think of it as the seller in the middle, right? And then there is an – kind of – call it a digital persona or that functional agent. it the pricing agent or the enablement agent or the marketing agent. They have – they're sort of context aware and they're most like an individual you might experience today in an organization that understands that their role sometimes transcends different functions and they aren't isolated.
digital agent or that persona is what I call kind of a skill agent. And think of a skill agent is that is an agent that can perform a very specific task, like go into a CRM and open up an opportunity. They know the clicks and the steps to just do that. And you would manage that skill agent almost like an employee, you'd performance management. You were asked to open up a hundred opportunities.
over the last 90 days and you opened up 90 successfully, 10 didn't open up and then you – like good process management, you dive into why did those 10 not open up and then you course correct the skill agent to figure out, what went wrong and what do we do differently to resolve it. And then underneath that digital persona agent, that pricing agent or that – you might have 10, 50,
You could have any number of skill agents that all can do skills. And maybe that skill agent, use that skill also on one of the other agents. they can be connected in different ways.
But I hear a lot of is different managers grabbing different tools and starting to put them to work inside the company. then IT is saying, wait, that's not a sanctioned tool yet. And then other parts of sales management saying, what are you doing? There's kind of a lot of chaos in there. Is this where you come in from the sales operations role and start bringing some clarity to the chaos?
Ben Taft (15:39.946)
Absolutely. It's putting some structure on that and it comes down to making sure that you A, understand what is the end result that somebody is trying to achieve and then number two is do you have a good process to get there and by the way, is that process consistent globally and across your different functions and ways of working?
even down to the semantics of how you speak about, for example, pipeline in EMEA versus how you speak about pipeline and deals in Korea or, you know, different even segments of the market, different language, different semantics. So you can't just turn on an engine and have it immediately understand all of that, right? That's where you may be where companies probably see chaos because they try and turn it on forgetting that
So.
Ben Taft (16:36.226)
They don't actually have a monolithic process for every one of those things. There's probably lot of regional and cultural and business nuance that goes into that. So I think folks in my role or we have an opportunity to be much more precise in looking at that process or that – what you're rolling out, Clint, there, what you described.
To start with, you've got to narrow it down to a very tight use case and understand what are the commonalities across those different ways of working and focus on that. Then you can build on that.
I got a provocative question for you. Who's leading that rollout? Who's leading that adoption? Is that the business side or is that IT who's leading it?
I think as always, that's the business side leading those rollouts. I think IT will play a larger role and maybe does play a larger role in the enterprise-wide rollouts, sort of the company-wide standards. think in any organization I've been a part of or you guys have been a part of, IT deploys a new platform or tool that everybody's going to be using and they create the basic swim lanes that you follow around and how it should be used.
And then I think different functions then figure out how do you tailor and adopt it or maximize it for your specific function. And that comes down to classic change management. We need to do X. This is the playground we have to stay within. Now let's figure out how we. Now as feedback comes back that says, hey, we'd really like it to be able to do this. That's when you go back and you partner with IT and other groups to say, we think we've got a really compelling use case to.
Ben Taft (18:24.238)
Can we go outside the swim lanes and expand the territory on how we use this thing? And then you go through the usual, does it make sense? Is that within the scope? Is it the right tool to do that? Is it the right way to think about it? And do we think that the final outcome for the sales organization, as an example, that that will really move the needle for them, right? As opposed to just being, you know, I think what I kind of call ornamental AI in some cases, which means it's
It's kind of flashy and it looks, but I think as leaders, need to be much more thoughtful about delivering meaningful AI as opposed to sort of the ornamental stuff that looks kind of shiny on the tree, but it really isn't, there isn't much behind.
I like that.
Greg (19:17.304)
Are you finding like a, you're finding a cultural shift where AI is really entering almost every conversation or strategic thought? you know, have we thought of where we could bake this in yet? we, are meetings moving towards that type of, you know, questioning as you get into strategic discussions?
Yeah, it's funny. Where was I? And it was toward the end of the day at some conference or whatever. I think the person stood up and it had been a full day of AI this and that. And I think he sort of stood up and said, I know what you're all thinking. Finally, a presentation that talks about AI. it was – but I think that in all those conversations, it's
it is being asked, is being talked about, is being looked at, is have we, you know, do we have an initiative around this? Do we, do we have, are we changing our way of thinking? How, and how do we use this to, back to my earlier statement about reimagine what we're trying to do with this? What potential does it give us? And then that, you know, that evolves into
looking at, if we are going to do that, do we understand what the use case is? we trust the data behind it? Do we think the process is good and right for it? And then that allows that conversation. But yes, I think it absolutely is involved in multiple conversations. And it's a balancing act to make sure you continue to, like I said, run the railroad, keep things moving, not get too distracted at times.
at the same time focusing on where this can be transformational.
Clint (21:10.478)
Well, let's use that as a transition into one of my favorite parts of these discussions. What are your favorite AI tools? What are the ones that you're seeing really work? Do you have some names that you can share with us that are making a big impact?
Um, obviously open AI and chat GPT is, it's got a, you know, a.
It's amazing how much you can do that. Like for a lot of companies, that is the focus is just how do I effectively roll out chat GPT across my company.
But I think a number of our, you the platforms that we leverage and from what I've seen some other platforms that I get either demoed on or whatnot that maybe I might look at, I think when I look at them and I look at the – how do I explain this?
the different ways that they've gone and solved a typical problem of – and we go back to the example of the market intelligence where I was talking about a seller has just met with somebody and they want to go get prepared, right? When I think about the way that you can go in with an effective LLM, whether it's OpenIrch, HGPD and then where you stitch together other resources, whether it's LinkedIn and
Ben Taft (22:37.144)
pitch book or some of these different resources, you can really create a very compelling picture of who you are engaged with and what matters in their industry and what matters to them and the individuals and what matters and how to connect it back to your own selling motions and your value prop. And I think that you can use these models.
to really do some effective coaching about, know, pretend I'm in this role and help me understand how this perspective might be looked at or come at me as if you're my competitor and, you know, help me get, you know, sharper on what type of things my competitor might throw it, you know, out in terms of FUD and how do I maybe get ahead of that? And I think some of a lot of the platforms out there that help
supplement this are doing a really great job of helping get sellers better armed and equipped in those types of conversations, maybe than the traditional – what is it, Greg? 15 years. How many years ago would you have had to gone on? You look for the marketing battle card with the four quadrants and you were studying the battle card and it was very kind of static and it was very – then you get on the call, you had to learn a lot.
Yeah.
Greg (24:07.128)
Considered it. Once you get the battle card, you're considered an expert for the year. Like nothing's gonna change.
It's it's the hey the battle cards on SharePoint. where's where's the SharePoint? it's over there and then you go find well that battle cards four years old
Yes. And so I think when you would – your question about what – I think that's an example I think where these tools are bringing such a different perspective on how people prepare for conversations and it gives them an opportunity to create a much more engaging way to absorb that information.
It allows people to put it into ways where they can digest it. And, you know, they, they can log in, put all this in, drop it into what is it? One of the various, is it notebook, right? And turn it into a podcast. And suddenly, you know, Joe Rogan and Oprah are doing a mock podcast of the market intelligence information in a way that a person listens to on their drive home. And that becomes much more engaging way to digest that and absorb it.
Yeah, no, exactly. Clint and come from completely different sides of the organization and, uh, know, salespeople like to listen and they like to talk and, you know, being able to, you know, you know, bring a, put a case study into, uh, you know, in just in the chat GPT and being able to use voice to interact with the case study and interview it to learn. It's so much faster than reading a 32 page.
Greg (25:48.386)
you know, case study, you know, for a salesperson and digestible. And, you know, I could see where this is going to change a lot in terms of in terms of the intelligence of the sales force going out into the field.
I think it solves the what are they used to talk about, the hammock effect on sales training and getting people, it's like a hammock, right, which is curved, right? And at the one end of the hammock, at the start of the call and the training or the materials, everyone's peaked and they're interested to see what's going on. And then as they see the agenda and the content, their attention starts to wane and then they drop off down to the bottom of the hammock where they're focused on their shopping list for when they get home and then doing whatever.
And then as they can tell, the call's about to end. It's the other end of the hammock where they listen real closely to see if there's an action item for them, right?
Exactly, yeah.
But now I think they can grab all this information, put it in ways that resonate with them and how their mind thinks and tailor it to how they're selling motion. it maximizes the individual. It maximizes the content in all sorts of different ways. And I think that that's one of the areas I get really excited about. And it brings in a lot of disparate information that normally would have taken hours for somebody to
Ben Taft (27:08.706)
back to being an operator, going to all those different places and pulling it all together and not seeing the full picture.
So in there from the tools perspective, I heard a lot of value to get out of chat GPT, but also check out notebook LLM and that text to podcast capability. That sounds like a good one.
Greg (27:38.72)
So Clint, what did you think of the AI voice on the intro this time?
So we keep changing them up. I think it's a fun way of just continuously seeing all the different possibilities with AI voices. Absolutely. But this one just kind of made me laugh a little bit, because it was a British voice, right? And as an American, I can't help but hear a British voice and think fussy, prim and proper. There's just some guy talking, right? But that was kind of the reaction I had to it.
Yeah, no, I had good time making it though. Yeah. Every time I do that, I cycle through a bunch and I just start laughing and I've definitely found a hobby with this. So I'm going to keep changing it up the AI voices. So get ready.
they change the script a little bit right each one has
Every time I hit the Generate button, I don't change a prompt, a word, anything, and it just regenerates the AdLib completely different. That's the fun part. Okay, it's time for the AI Challenge. Now, the AI Challenge is a takeaway assignment where people can get used to using AI in business, and it's a fun exercise to just jump in and play with.
Clint (28:51.598)
This week's AI challenge is a little bit of a twist on some of the things that we've done in the past. You're going to go into your favorite large language model. There's that Chat Cheapie Tea, Copilot, Gemini, any of them will work. And you're going to upload a customer case study from your business. And you're going to ask questions to the case study. You're going to interview a case study and get some insights on how you can best work with your next customer.
So look in our show notes and you'll find a link to the blog and that's going to have all the instructions you need to complete the challenge. When you're done, be sure to share your experience in the blog comment boxes. Now, if you have an AI story to share with us and want to be on Prompt This, go to www.promptthis.ai, go to the contact page and put in a request. We'll be in contact with you.
Clint (29:51.342)
Well, hey, Ben, we really appreciate your time today. This was a great session to get in the mind of a sales operations leader in a large company who's thinking about how he deploys AI across very large, very global companies. So appreciate your time. Thank you very much.
Thanks for having me guys. Great discussion.
Alright, thanks man.
And that's another episode of Prompt This.
Thanks for tuning in with Clinton Greg today. You can dive into all the exciting Prompt This episodes and explore a treasure trove of in-depth articles over at www.promptthis.ai. And don't forget, hit that follow button right below to stay updated on all the latest.
